In the first of a new series in support of Drinklusive, William Wong interviews Olly Smith.
Tara writes Diversity is what attracts us to the wine world – a diversity of grapes, places, flavours and cultures – and yet there is a marked lack of diversity among the people working in the industry. So we were excited when Aidy Smith and TheThreeDrinkers asked us if we’d like to mentor the first cohort of mentees in Drinklusive, a programme aimed at increasing the diversity of the drinks world through engagement with UK-based people in the LGBTQIA+ or disability communities or underrepresented ethnicities.
Over the next few months, each one of them will be interviewing inspiring people in the drinks industry, thereby expanding their world while enriching ours as well. First up: William Wong, a London-based photographer making moves into the wine world. He interviews Olly Smith, a prolific author and British TV wine expert best known for recommending affordable and delicious wines to accompany the dishes featured on BBC One’s Saturday Kitchen Live.
Smith is also co-founder of Three Wine Men with Oz Clarke and Tim Atkin MW, hosting consumer wine tastings around the UK, and curates the wine list for The Glass House onboard P&O Cruises. In 2024, Smith was voted one of the Top 100 Most Influential People in Drinks. Wong met with Smith one morning in Vagabond Wines, London Victoria, discussing everything from Pingu and George Harrison to the importance of mediation – and, of course, wine.
William When and how did you get into wine?
My parents didn’t drink much at all. There might be a bottle of French red around Easter, and the occasional beer. My father used to drink that Dutch beer which ‘refreshes the parts that other beers cannot reach’. It tasted like metal. That was probably because I was licking the can!
The first experience with wine dates back to Charterhouse [School in Surrey] where I joined the wine society in sixth form. There was one big oaky turbo-charged Petaluma Chardonnay from the cool Piccadilly Valley of the Adelaide Hills, South Australia. Oak was not a framing device; it was a sustaining headline for entertainment … that flavour lasted and sat on the palate for so long!
Then during the school holidays, I took a summer job as a cellar boy, delivering boxes for Orange Co Vintners in Jersey. The wine labels were fascinating – lexicon and languages like a window to a much wider world. It was in the cellar I met Eamonn, a former publican from Ireland who was in charge of the store deliveries.
Eamonn’s wisdom: ‘you obviously need to know about the wine, its grape varietals, origin and so on. But who is the wine for? Don’t think about yourself. Think about the person in front of you. What are their favourite flavours? What kind of wine do they already like? What is their budget and on the menu tonight?’
That was a lightbulb for me! I realised wine is an amazing way to connect with people, to learn more about them no matter what their cultural background is.
And in the early 1990s, the Aussies invaded Britain with their Lindeman’s, Jacob’s Creek Semillon Chardonnay and the like. The wine was fresh, labels easy to understand with a genuine buzz. I thought these wines were key to getting far more people excited to try and talk about wine with more confidence.
Even today, a huge part of my job is getting people excited about wine in the first place, building confidence, and then recommending not just wines or regions and places; but listening and talking to other people. So, credit to Eamonn.
What did you do after university?
I came down to London and decided that I wanted to break into writing screenplays and so forth. So I got a job in an art library in Notting Hill called the Bridgman Art Library. I did that for only one or maybe two years, while I was writing scripts at night. My friend Jim and I put together a pitch for an animation series, kind of useless Flash Gordon: Inspector Clouseau meets Flash Gordon or Inspector Clouseau meets Doctor Who set in space but with an imbecile as the lead character who’s incompetent and yet incredibly lovable. To our great surprise, the BBC optioned it quite early. They never formally made the show but people began taking notice of us writing these rock’n’roll animations.
So I ended up writing for quite big shows like Pingu the penguin. I was writing on that for three series. I look back very fondly on those days of writing Pingu; it was good discipline as Pingu doesn’t speak. Most people think when you write a script, you just write the dialogue. That’s not the case. You write everything that happens in the episode. So if I was writing this scene, I would describe every plant, the wall, the table, how full your glasses are and what you’re wearing. Every aspect of you and then the dialogue really is the last thing you come to. It’s like writing silent movies. You have to rely on gesticulation and very pure emotions. That was great training to think: how do you really communicate with your body, rather than your voice. It’s how you say it as well as what you’re saying.
There’s also Charlie and Lola, with one episode of ‘Lolaland’ winning an award at the Monstra Animation Festival. I also wrote for a day on kind of a writers’ meeting about Wallace & Gromit: The Curse of the Were-Rabbit. So if you wait long enough through the credits, you’ll see my name. Tiny part but true.
How did you get to where you are now?
The jump into wine came from the time writing Pingu. It was 2005 when Hardy’s, the Australian wine company, launched ‘Wine Idol’, a competition in the UK. They were looking for the Jamie Oliver of wine – a new communicator in wine. And my screenwriter friend Mark Huckabee kept saying, ‘You should apply for this. All you talk about is wine. You’re a good scriptwriter, but you’re an even better communicator about wine. It’s clearly your passion.’ I thought that’s true, actually I did spend pretty much all my spare cash on getting bottles, taking them home and writing tasting notes.
So you had no aspiration to get into the wine trade then?
Not at the time. Wine was absolutely my hobby but as I was married and my wife Sophie was expecting our first daughter Ruby, I might get told off! But I had always been fascinated with questions like ‘would this wine taste different if someone else made it?’ or ‘how would it be if it was two miles down the road?’ Mark also said, ‘if you don’t do it, I’ll never forgive you!’ He’s still a good friend of mine, and a very successful screenwriter.
What happened with the Wine Idol competition?
Over 6,000 people downloaded the form. We had to write and record ourselves on tape. There were no smartphones back then. We were living in Lewes near Brighton in Sussex and I fell in love with Peter Hall’s Breaky Bottom wines. His wines were a little out of my price range and I would buy for special occasions. When this competition came along, I was really nervous about how to do it. I decided I wanted to film the journey from roots to vine to grape, to fermentation to liquid to bottle and to sale. We had to do everything in one minute.
I remember plucking up the confidence to phone Peter Hall saying I needed to do this competition and asked if I could film in his vineyard. He said, ‘You better come and meet me’.
It’s the most enchanting way up to his winery in the Sussex Downs through a valley and you come over the top of the Downs. I think it’s one of the most beautiful vineyards in the UK. It stretches down before you, surrounded by an oasis of nature. Wildlife galore and a little food barn. The landscape is a lush tapestry of green.
Peter allowed me to film at his vineyard on one condition: ‘Win’. I said I will give it my best shot.
I remember kneeling at his vines looking at the soil doing a little piece about the vines, talking about the fruit, the place and a little bit on the bottling; and then zooming back to Harvey’s wine to wrap up.
Then I was through to the final nine contestants, and the last three. On the night, it was a blind tasting and I thought it was a Hardy’s Shiraz. The judges took their time in deliberation. When they called out my name, I couldn’t believe it! Bill Hardy gave me the prize.
What was the prize?
There were two parts: a year’s supply of Hardy’s wines, which was great, but what I really wanted was a chance to be auditioned at a screen test at Prospect Pictures, producers of Good Food Live and Saturday Kitchen. The audition went well. The producer told me to go on a show with the chef Brian Turner the following week. He was cooking double-thickness pork chops. I recommended the Chilean De Martino Legado Chardonnay from Oddbins. Everyone thinks roast pork means red but oaked Chardonnay is a perfect match.
Was that the beginning of your TV stardom?
Well, when I won Wine Idol in early 2005, my wife Sophie was pregnant with Ruby, our first daughter. Sophie said to me, ‘you’ve got a great job. You’re working with the big names. Wallace & Gromit might end up in Hollywood … what are you doing?’ I told her, ‘We have a baby coming and I’ll give it six months. I’ll do both and see if it takes off.’ Then bit by bit, I was booked on more shows. Good Food Live booked me back and I went on Channel 4’s food programmes.
Then the big break came when Amanda Ross from Cactus TV gave me the job as the wine expert on the Richard and Judy Wine Club, which was a huge 5 pm show on Channel 4 with millions of viewers. Soon after, Amanda began producing Saturday Kitchen for the BBC. I was on episode two in 2006 and she wanted me on the team. Eighteen years on, we are still here!
You are best known for food and wine pairing tips on Saturday Kitchen Live. What’s the secret?
We get sent the recipes in advance and I love cooking at home. I actually wrote this book about pairing food and wine and created all the recipes myself. It’s something that I feel really passionately about from working on various projects over the years, and meeting and knowing lots of chefs in my life who have become good friends.
So after trying the recipe at home, I will then call in some samples and taste the wines I had tried at press tastings where I made notes on the wines. You have to choose those that are appropriate at the price point, and others which might be stylistically appropriate but very reliant on a dish. So whenever I’m making wine notes, I’ll also put where the recommendation would best sit plus food indications in case I need them. I create and build a background lexicon there that I could draw on in the future. Our brief is trying to stick to £10.
I think you have to know 100% the pairing is going to work. Millions of people are watching and you’re standing by it on TV. Lots of people will go and buy that wine, and potentially cook the dish.
Basically, keep it simple. Don’t overthink. If it’s tomato-based, Italian wines. For shellfish, coastal wines. Focus on the strongest flavours in the dish; say for curry fish. Do you want the wine to complement, or contrast? For refreshment or contemplation? If it didn’t work, it’s not the end of the world. Give it a go. But when it works, that will unlock magic.
My motto is ‘all for wine and wine for all’. It’s about personal preference to a degree, but it’s also about trusting that there truly is a wine for every occasion, every palate, every pocket and every food pairing.
What’s the most memorable wine you have had?
I am a massive fan of Hungarian Tokaj. It reminds me of one of my first press trips. There was one time out in the field during harvest. There was precious juice seeping out of the Aszú berries, incredibly thick and syrupy. The vitality of flavour was like a lightning flash! My whole being swept clean and I vanished. It’s not even wine, it’s just juice, and it was so memorable and delightful.
What do you do for fun?
I’m obsessed with music so I have a large vinyl collection. My dad was a musician and a music teacher. I grew up as a musician as you know. [Smith became a chorister at King’s College, Cambridge, at the age of 10.]
I brought this record along because it’s one of the things that means the most to me. George Harrison – I’m a huge fan of George’s solo work, besides having an extraordinary career with The Beatles. I didn’t know him but I love that he was someone who was inquiring the examined life. I think that’s something very important.
Where in the world associated with wine do you most want to visit or revisit?
I would like to live in Greece, to marshal a vineyard there. I’ve been going since I was 19, at least once a year. I love all aspects of Greek wine and I thank [pioneering wine importer] Steve Daniel for all he’s done for Greek wine.
The diverse range of Greek grapes is amazing. There’s so much more than Assyrtiko. I love Assyrtiko but there’s Vidiano and Malagousia. On the red you have Xinomavro but also Agiorgitiko. There are wonderful grapes in different climates. Everybody thinks Greece is hot. Actually Greece has got amazing cool climates high up.
England follows closely. I actually have eight vines in my garden. Pinot Meunier. Can you imagine? I make a little wine every year. I just bought a little strip of land off the farmer next door. I’m going to plant some more!
What would the 12-year-old Olly say to the present you?
Do more yoga. Keep moving. Be faster in your body. I have a personal trainer, but I think my 12-year-old self would say: ‘be more aware of your body. You wanna live in this body for as long as you can have fun with it. Use it. Express with it but take care of it.’
What’s the one question you wish journos have asked but no one’s ever done?
It’s along the lines of ‘are you as extrovert as you seem on the shows?’ I love performing and I love people but I do need my quiet time as well. My brother summed it up brilliantly: I am a unique combination of being monkish and gregarious; kind of an equal measure and I think that’s true. There’s an assumption I’m like a 24-hour Duracell Bunny, but it’s not true at all.
Olly Smith (above right) @ollysmith lives in Lewes, Sussex with his wife, Sophie, and daughter Lily (17); his daughter Ruby (19) has just left for university. He is patron of the Drinks Trust and the Bumblebee Conservation Trust.
William Wong (above left) @fino_vino_malts is a London-based photographer and wine writer.
All photos of Smith by William Wong; Pingu credit CBBC.